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This is intended for the touring player in the tssc tourney

"Rant on your Soapbox" Revived!

This is intended for the touring player in the tssc tourney

Postby mark_tran » Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:38 pm

This is simply a rant. It is directed at one person and I don't mean to imply anything about anyone else by it :D

So last Saturday morning I participated in the Toronto Sports and Social Club's Spring Tune-up tournament. The tournament was going along great and I was having lots of fun despite my team not doing as well as I had hoped when suddenly, during our fourth(?) game, this happened:

I caught the disc just in-bounds while on defence but momentum took me out of bounds and to my surprise, as I came back to the line to put the disc back into play, I found a player from the opposing team already counting out stall 4 (let's not take into consideration the huge fast count since it only took me about 2 seconds to recover and get back to the line). Upon being greeted by stall 5, I asked him to please wait until I put the disc into play before initiating the stall count, all while he continued to count stalls so that by the time I finished my sentence, he had reached stall 8.

At this point I knew that discussing the rules with this guy was obviously out of the question so I asked for their team captain in order for us to settle this quickly. Here's the best part: The guy then rudely says to me "I'm a touring player. I know the rules"(obviously implying that he knows the rules better than me).

I'll never know if he was their captain or if their captain was too embarrassed to show themselves but I decided to let it slide for the sake of everyone else itching to continue the game.

I've checked the rules and guess what? Me, a simple everyday player who just starting really playing Ultimate last summer, was right.

See rules section IX In- and Out-of-bounds as well as section XIII The Turnover subsection B: For a live disc to be put into play, the thrower must establish a pivot at the appropriate spot on the field, touch the disc to the ground, and put it into play.

/end rant
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Postby GregS » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:27 pm

It's not quite that simple. XIV.A.2 reads in part:
Only the marker (II.K) may initiate or continue a stall count, and may do so anytime a thrower has possession of a disc that is live or in play.

You caught the disc, meaning that you are now a thrower in possession of the disc. II.R gives the definitions of "live" and "in play", with "live" being the situation here:
A disc is live when players are allowed to move and the disc is subject to a turnover, but the thrower cannot make a legal pass (e.g., walking the disc to the spot where it is to be put into play).

According to those rules, the marker could initiate the stall count on you at any time.

BUT XIV.A.2 goes on:
However, directly after a turnover or when putting the pull into play the stall may not be initiated before a pivot is established, unless delay of game or pre-stall rules apply.

Delay of game and pre-stall rules don't apply, so the stall count can't be initiated before a pivot is established. My guess is that it's this part of the rule that your marker wasn't aware of.

So, it seems that you were right, but not for the reason you thought. :D If you'd been on offence and caught the pass but your momentum carried you out of bounds, the marker would have been well within his rights to count stalls as soon as you had possession, no need to wait for you to return and establish a pivot.
Did you get that thing I sent you?
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